Weight Watchers - 3rd Time a Charm? Most likely not

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Frustrated09 Frustrated09
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Weight Watchers - 3rd Time a Charm? Most likely not

Well, my wife has decided to try out the WW for the third time. If history repeats itself, this will last for two to four weeks and result in no obvious weight loss - when you are 107 pounds above the healthy range, even a 10 pound loss is unnoticeable.

Even if I were to get my hopes up and think she could lose 50 pounds - she would still have a BMI of 35 and be in the severely obese category - not to mention were is all that excess skin from her panniculus, 42DD's, and all the other unsightly places go?
Just Leave Just Leave
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Re: Weight Watchers - 3rd Time a Charm? Most likely not

There  are huge flaws in WW and that is the point system and the notion of support.  Your wife need to count calories and eat the correct amount to achieve a healthy BMI.  She is looking for a magic solution. That's why she's fat and why she will remain fat all her life. Food means more to her than you do.  
Rose Rose
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Re: Weight Watchers - 3rd Time a Charm? Most likely not

In reply to this post by Frustrated09
Hey, Frustrated Dog!
Just a question...... should she succeed in losing the weight, are you still going to hate her and find her unattractive because of the "excess skin" and other "unsightly places"?  Because if you are, and that is the atmosphere she is working in, she won't succeed, unless she develops enough resentment towards you to achieve her goal to spite you.  Then, you will have a thin, albeit "unsightly" (to you) wife who might not find you so attractive.  Ask my spouse.  I am 50 lbs. down, 20 to go and he and I will be having an interesting discussion about his place in my life when I hit goal.  He has been negative, insulting, and just plain mean, making the entire thing a much more difficult ordeal than it needed to be and that is something I am not likely to ever forget.  
If your wife has been to WW before, you are somewhat aware of the workings of the program and probably aware of the pitfalls that caused her to fail previously.  If you still love her and want her thin, help her.  If she is a junk food junkie, get rid of the stuff.  This is a great time of year to go through the pantry and donate to a food bank.  If she replaces it, donate it.  If she is a mom and finishes the food on the kids plates because "you can't waste food", clean off the table and the dishes before she does.  If she nibbles at leftovers, cook for the meal only, no leftovers.  You can see where I am going with this.   Long lasting weight loss depends on behavior modification.  Sometimes it is difficult for the fattie to recognize the the behaviors that contribute to their weight gain.
I think it is M2 who stresses "mindful eating".  That is a real valuable concept to incorporate into an lifelong eating plan.  You might want to help her figure out why she is standing in front of the fridge, grazing.  Is she hungry or bored, or angry or sad, anxious?  Maybe you could direct her to some other activity or show her some attention for a few minutes until her moment has passed.  
Your post shows how frustrated and defeated you are.  If you can imagine any future with her, encourage her and help her.  When she succeeds, she will remember that you did and have a reason to control her weight for the rest of her life.  If she fails again, you will have the satisfaction of knowing you did the right things to help her.
Oh, and this is the toughest time of year to start a program.  The next 6 weeks are filled with food themed occasions and it is not likely she will lose a lot of weight.  Try to not be too disappointed.  Even thin people gain weight over the holidays.  Just try to be supportive once the new year starts.
 
Rosie
WuKong WuKong
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Re: Weight Watchers - 3rd Time a Charm? Most likely not

Rose,

I think Frustrated following your suggestion would likely lead to a lot more resentment than could be caused for by him having distaste for the consequences of his wife's gluttonous choices.

Seems odd to me that a solution suggested by a woman is one that women relish in bashing and labelling men with doing - controlling their women.

In addition, as the poor dead horse is nearly unrecognizable, handling gluttony is not supported in our society the way that handling the other cardinal sins or addictions are. Though there are TV shows that can get away with it, in real life, anyone applying your suggested techniques or the ones represented in these shows would be met with condemnation and brow beating from the fit spouse's peers.
"Worthless people live only to eat and drink; people of worth eat and drink only to live." -
  --  Socrates
WuKong WuKong
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Re: Weight Watchers - 3rd Time a Charm? Most likely not

In reply to this post by Frustrated09
Now, to comment on the loss of attraction due to the consequences of a gluttonous spouse's choices. I think a good analogy, in this regard, would be like losing attraction for a spouse that has destroyed, or even lost, their teeth because of a nasty tabacco chewing habit. Even if they quit their habit, the damage has been done and I don't think it fair at all to hold it against their spouse if they found this unattractive.

"Worthless people live only to eat and drink; people of worth eat and drink only to live." -
  --  Socrates
Rose Rose
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In reply to this post by WuKong
Wu-
I don't see it as controlling at all.  As I said, she may not have identified the behaviors that lead to her overeating.  As a concerned partner, he may be better able to see what has tripped her up in the past and help her avoid the same pitfalls this time around.
My H is an alcoholic in recovery.  He was a nasty drunk.  I asked him and asked him to get help, but he loved the way he felt when he drank.  He cut back on his drinking for about a year, things were better between us and we decided to have a child.  While I was pregnant, he decided to completely stop drinking, for the sake of the baby.  It never occurred to me to think he loved the baby more than me because he would quit for it and not for me.  Anyway, I attended AA meetings with him (pregnant and in a smoke filled room, ugh!) on a daily basis, read the Big Book with him, encouraged him, removed all the alcohol from our home, avoided social situations where alcohol would be served, and avoided being with friends who drank.  Was this controlling him?  I never looked at it as such.  I only thought I was doing what I could to help him be successful with a very challenging program.  Two years later, he relapsed.  We had two children by this time.  His drinking was affecting his career in a negative way.  I was very disappointed and frustrated with him.  Within a few months, he saw that he was better off sober and returned to AA, completed the 12 steps and has been sober for 19 years.  He rarely needs to attend meetings, is able to attend functions where alcohol is served and I can keep alcohol in the house without a lot of worry.  I believe that as his wife, it was my responsibility to help him in any way I could, not sit back and wait for him to fail.  Do I resent the permanent damage he did to his career and our family income?  Not really.  I was just grateful that he did not drink himself to death or have a car accident and hurt someone else.  I am grateful for AA and that he was able to use it to quit drinking.
However, would I help him again?  Good question.  Knowing what I do now about relationships and that unconditional love does not exist, I might just sit back and resent him until he drank himself into a coma.  It would be a lot easier than going through the whole thing all over again.  No, even as pissed off at him as I am for cramming candy bars down his face while in my presence, for saying nasty things about my appearance, and for being totally unsupportive, I would still help him should he relapse again.  Maybe I am the crazy one.
 
WuKong WuKong
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Re: Weight Watchers - 3rd Time a Charm? Most likely not

I guess you missed my point.

Maybe this'll help make it clearer. I think your suggestion SHOULD be a valid way to handle a gluttonous partner but, in our current society, it is not acceptable to treat food addiction the same as addiction (as in your example) to alcohol. There is no AA equivalent for gluttons. There is no societal support to do things such as interventions, with a gluttonous spouse as is acceptable for any other kind of addiction.

The same actions you were able to take with your husband for alcoholism should be socially acceptable and SUPPORTED for gluttony.
"Worthless people live only to eat and drink; people of worth eat and drink only to live." -
  --  Socrates
popsicletoes popsicletoes
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Re: Weight Watchers - 3rd Time a Charm? Most likely not

Hello,
Supporting an alcoholic/drug addicted spouse is one of the most selfless, loving, sacrificial things anyone could possibly do. There is no comparison, whatsoever, between living with an overweight spouse and living with an alcoholic. Even, dare I say, a sober alcoholic.
Those of us who have been fat  understand that we were hurting ourselves mostly, and metabolism, cultural influences, and food ADDICTION made it painfully slow to lose the weight. Yes, we were addicts, but one can be very law-and-order and still be fat. No one wants to embarrass their loved ones in public by being an elephant--that hurts us too.
But alcoholics/druggies aren't even considering another's feelings ever, and therein lies the difference.
WuKong WuKong
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popsicletoes wrote
Hello,
Supporting an alcoholic/drug addicted spouse is one of the most selfless, loving, sacrificial things anyone could possibly do. There is no comparison, whatsoever, between living with an overweight spouse and living with an alcoholic. Even, dare I say, a sober alcoholic.
Those of us who have been fat  understand that we were hurting ourselves mostly, and metabolism, cultural influences, and food ADDICTION made it painfully slow to lose the weight. Yes, we were addicts, but one can be very law-and-order and still be fat. No one wants to embarrass their loved ones in public by being an elephant--that hurts us too.
But alcoholics/druggies aren't even considering another's feelings ever, and therein lies the difference.
That's the lie gluttons use to justify themselves and the same lie society believes to condemn the victims of these food addicts.

There is NO difference. Addiction is a problem because it's an addiction and its consequences, not as much because of what the person is addicted to.

The fat will have consequences. Some immediately but, many later. The health consequences will become a significant financial burden and will likely also become a major physical and emotional burden on all those that'll have to accomodate and take care of their fat SO/relative. The fatty will likely not live as long and could end up denying their grandkids of a grandparent, or likely at best be a grandparent that can't really be involved in their lives.

Such bullshit that it's not the same! There's a lot more consequences to someone being overweight than just the loss of physical attractiveness.
"Worthless people live only to eat and drink; people of worth eat and drink only to live." -
  --  Socrates
RiderX RiderX
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In reply to this post by popsicletoes
popsicletoes wrote
Hello,
Supporting an alcoholic/drug addicted spouse is one of the most selfless, loving, sacrificial things anyone could possibly do. There is no comparison, whatsoever, between living with an overweight spouse and living with an alcoholic. Even, dare I say, a sober alcoholic.
There are many comparisons; an obese spouse is destroying their health and the relationship, it's something they could control if they chose to, the fit spouse is deeply affected by the situation, but has essentially no control over it, all of those things are common. A significant difference, as Wu pointed out, is that society supports the idea of helping an alcoholic recover, while it largely condemns the spouse of an obese SO for wanting them to do something about their problem.

popsicletoes wrote
Those of us who have been fat  understand that we were hurting ourselves mostly, and metabolism, cultural influences, and food ADDICTION made it painfully slow to lose the weight.
Fair enough, but you are not in a position to understand the pain, frustration and helplessness of being the spouse of such an individual.  As Athol Kay describes it, it is a very private, lonely kind of hell. If you haven't been there, you won't get it.

popsicletoes wrote
Hello,
Yes, we were addicts, but one can be very law-and-order and still be fat.
I don't get this part, I've known plenty of alcoholics who were law-abiding citizens.

popsicletoes wrote
But alcoholics/druggies aren't even considering another's feelings ever, and therein lies the difference.
If you were considerate of your spouse's feelings, then that sets you apart from many obese SO's. Many regard the fit spouse's feelings toward their obesity and the effect it has on the relationship not merely with indifference, but outright contempt, and our political correctness-obsessed society tells them they are absolutely right for doing so.

How well do you think it would work if an alcoholic or drug addict insisted "you're the one with the problem, if you really loved me, you'd accept me and be attracted to me just the way I am". therein lies the difference.
Rose Rose
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In reply to this post by WuKong
Wu,
I see your point.
Still, is it less painful to watch someone hurting them self and their family for the sake of the addiction.  Or is it less painful to help them achieve their goal, given that they may stumble or fail yet again? All in the name of political correctness?
 
This guy's wife is starting a diet, again.  She has been unsuccessful in the past.  Now, he may have been supportive previously, he did not make that clear.  All I am saying is that he can sit back and be miserable because he expects her to fail (and his attitude towards her may help her fail) or he can do some small things to show support.  Who will arrest him for donating junk food to the food bank?  The snack police?  Who will vilify him for cooking healthy food in appropriate amounts and cleaning off the table? ( I'd be over the moon thrilled if anyone here would lessen my contact with food while I am trying to change my attitude and habits about it.)  His kids might get a little cranky if they don't get their Twinkies, but they should not be eating them anyway.  What I am suggesting is benign, non confrontational, good for ya anyway, actions that are supportive without being controlling. If she fails, she fails.  But if she succeeds, he wins, too.

So many of the fit spouses are so frustrated and have thrown in the towel and are waiting for the kids to grow up so they can leave and find someone else.  If you are just treading water in the relationship, and the opportunity comes up to help fix the situation, why not take it?  If things don't work out and you leave when the youngest reaches majority, you are going to be carrying a sack of resentment anyway.  Will it really be that much heavier because you made every attempt to help your spouse get thin?
 
Rosie
CattleIron CattleIron
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Re: Weight Watchers - 3rd Time a Charm? Most likely not

Shes being set up for failure. shell never lose her addiction to sweets and never lose the weigh because once the sow comes off her  planned feed she'll blimp right back out again.  
popsicletoes popsicletoes
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In reply to this post by RiderX
I was never the smug, self-assured fat woman. Judging from the responses I have received, I am a rare bird. I was absolutely miserable being fat, was embarassed to go outside, and was horrified to find out that my ex- husband found me repulsive  (even though he was in lousy shape himself).
Speaking of my former abusive ol' man, might I add that he was addicted to pot like many other fatsos. His bleary-eyed stupor and corn-chip eating frenzies repulsed ME, but he didn't care about MY feelings and the fact that I was ashamed to be seen with HIM as well. So yes, I understand the frustrations of many of the posters here.
I've changed my ways--stopped eating junk, stopped any alcohol, sodas, any crap at all. It took my pothead ex-husband a heart attack to change his ways, and yet he still doesn't seem to care about his looks. But I'm different-- I work out very hard to be fit, as it is not good enough to just be a 'thinling'. I want to get buff!
I need to clarify this: a reasonably ashamed fat person will lose the weight but needs emotional support and lots of time. Rapid weight loss can be dangerous and will make one look haggard in the face. Everyone does not have fattitude, I certainly did not. Most fat people would love to be fit, but again, it takes time.
It is better to invest your time with an ambitous fat person than with a pothead, trust me on that one.
Frustrated09 Frustrated09
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In reply to this post by Rose
Rose wrote
Wu,
I see your point.
Still, is it less painful to watch someone hurting them self and their family for the sake of the addiction.  Or is it less painful to help them achieve their goal, given that they may stumble or fail yet again? All in the name of political correctness?
 
This guy's wife is starting a diet, again.  She has been unsuccessful in the past.  Now, he may have been supportive previously, he did not make that clear.  All I am saying is that he can sit back and be miserable because he expects her to fail (and his attitude towards her may help her fail) or he can do some small things to show support.  Who will arrest him for donating junk food to the food bank?  The snack police?  Who will vilify him for cooking healthy food in appropriate amounts and cleaning off the table? ( I'd be over the moon thrilled if anyone here would lessen my contact with food while I am trying to change my attitude and habits about it.)  His kids might get a little cranky if they don't get their Twinkies, but they should not be eating them anyway.  What I am suggesting is benign, non confrontational, good for ya anyway, actions that are supportive without being controlling. If she fails, she fails.  But if she succeeds, he wins, too.

So many of the fit spouses are so frustrated and have thrown in the towel and are waiting for the kids to grow up so they can leave and find someone else.  If you are just treading water in the relationship, and the opportunity comes up to help fix the situation, why not take it?  If things don't work out and you leave when the youngest reaches majority, you are going to be carrying a sack of resentment anyway.  Will it really be that much heavier because you made every attempt to help your spouse get thin?
 
Rosie
Yes, I am defeated. 12 years of this continual weight gain has given me next to zero hope she will achieve any LONG LASTING weight loss. She will lose 10 or 20 over the two to four week period then an illness or stressful event will trigger things back to normal and the 10 or 20 she loses will come back at 20 or 30 - rinse, lather, repeat.

As far as ridding the junk food, I still find HoHo, ding dong, and other little debbie snack wrappers in the vehicle and none of those things are in our pantry  I can't oversee her 24/7 and require her not to stop at 7-11 for a fix.  
Rose Rose
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Re: Weight Watchers - 3rd Time a Charm? Most likely not

I am sorry for your experience.  I know how difficult it is to watch someone you love evolve into a stranger due to their addiction.  I am one of those people who keeps trying......until.  
 
So last night we rented the movie "Absentia".  I was surprised that the actors were not slim or beautiful.  They were overweight, ordinary people.  H was making unkind comments about the actress who plays the principal character.  She is both pregnant and hugely overweight.  The actress is Katie Parker.  I looked her up on IMDb and her pictures there were of a knockout.  I noticed in her resume she is in a documentary called Inner Weigh.  I am assuming she used this program to get thin, but I don't know that for sure.  I have looked at the website and the videos on Youtube and will buy the video for myself.  Basically, it is not a diet, but a plan to use our mind and perception of self to make the permanent changes necessary to be a healthy weight and fit.
 
I do know that for me, if I don't change my relationship with food, I will fight to maintain my weight loss for the rest of my life, an exhausting and endless battle.  That is why I have been working to stop using food to make myself feel better or calm myself when I am stressed.  This Inner Weigh program just seems be along the same line as what I am doing but with some concrete techniques for doing that.
 
I don't know if Mrs. Dog would be receptive to something like this, but it might help her to understand why she is eating HoHos and Debbies while she is on Weight Watchers and help her give them up for something better that will end her struggle with weight.
 
Please don't ream me for suggesting this website.  I just wanted to share what I found in case it is something that others would be interested in.  I know there are tons of weight loss programs and self help programs out there.  This one just seems to meet my need to be at peace with myself and achieve and maintain a healthy, fit mind and body.
 
Rosie  
Matilda Tuesday Matilda Tuesday
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In reply to this post by Frustrated09
Give her a pat on the back for doing something and start working on your own happiness. It's all you can do really. Don't feel like you gotta hang in there forever. Make some plans, save some money. Do what you need to do. She'll be fine, but that frustration is going to eat yo alive.
Frustrated09 Frustrated09
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Frustrated09 wrote
Well, my wife has decided to try out the WW for the third time. If history repeats itself, this will last for two to four weeks and result in no obvious weight loss - when you are 107 pounds above the healthy range, even a 10 pound loss is unnoticeable.

Even if I were to get my hopes up and think she could lose 50 pounds - she would still have a BMI of 35 and be in the severely obese category - not to mention were is all that excess skin from her panniculus, 42DD's, and all the other unsightly places go?
Update

Height = 5'-0", Weight when we met (1992) 115, BMI = 22.5

Weight  this past November =  235, BMI 45.9

Best Weight = 217 in mid January, BMI 42.4 (I couldn't tell any difference)

Current Weight = 226, BMI 44.1

Still in the nasty 42DD's
Frustrated09 Frustrated09
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Frustrated09 wrote
Frustrated09 wrote
Well, my wife has decided to try out the WW for the third time. If history repeats itself, this will last for two to four weeks and result in no obvious weight loss - when you are 107 pounds above the healthy range, even a 10 pound loss is unnoticeable.

Even if I were to get my hopes up and think she could lose 50 pounds - she would still have a BMI of 35 and be in the severely obese category - not to mention were is all that excess skin from her panniculus, 42DD's, and all the other unsightly places go?
Update

Height = 5'-0", Weight when we met (1992) 115, BMI = 22.5

Weight  this past November =  235, BMI 45.9

Best Weight = 217 in mid January, BMI 42.4 (I couldn't tell any difference)

Current Weight = 226, BMI 44.1

Still in the nasty 42DD's
Current Weight (11_08_12) = 230, BMI 44.7

Still in the nasty 42DD's

What is the definition of insanity? Doing the same thing ver and over agian and expecting a diffirent result.

Frustrated09 Frustrated09
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In reply to this post by Frustrated09
Frustrated09 wrote
Rose wrote
Wu,
I see your point.
Still, is it less painful to watch someone hurting them self and their family for the sake of the addiction.  Or is it less painful to help them achieve their goal, given that they may stumble or fail yet again? All in the name of political correctness?
 
This guy's wife is starting a diet, again.  She has been unsuccessful in the past.  Now, he may have been supportive previously, he did not make that clear.  All I am saying is that he can sit back and be miserable because he expects her to fail (and his attitude towards her may help her fail) or he can do some small things to show support.  Who will arrest him for donating junk food to the food bank?  The snack police?  Who will vilify him for cooking healthy food in appropriate amounts and cleaning off the table? ( I'd be over the moon thrilled if anyone here would lessen my contact with food while I am trying to change my attitude and habits about it.)  His kids might get a little cranky if they don't get their Twinkies, but they should not be eating them anyway.  What I am suggesting is benign, non confrontational, good for ya anyway, actions that are supportive without being controlling. If she fails, she fails.  But if she succeeds, he wins, too.

So many of the fit spouses are so frustrated and have thrown in the towel and are waiting for the kids to grow up so they can leave and find someone else.  If you are just treading water in the relationship, and the opportunity comes up to help fix the situation, why not take it?  If things don't work out and you leave when the youngest reaches majority, you are going to be carrying a sack of resentment anyway.  Will it really be that much heavier because you made every attempt to help your spouse get thin?
 
Rosie
Yes, I am defeated. 12 years of this continual weight gain has given me next to zero hope she will achieve any LONG LASTING weight loss. She will lose 10 or 20 over the two to four week period then an illness or stressful event will trigger things back to normal and the 10 or 20 she loses will come back at 20 or 30 - rinse, lather, repeat.

As far as ridding the junk food, I still find HoHo, ding dong, and other little debbie snack wrappers in the vehicle and none of those things are in our pantry  I can't oversee her 24/7 and require her not to stop at 7-11 for a fix.
Fail, fail, fail, she will never succeed
Fred Fred
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Re: Weight Watchers - 3rd Time a Charm? Most likely not

In reply to this post by Frustrated09
In my experience, "Most likely not"

My wife is on WW now for the ? time. And by on it I mean I see the charge on the credit card for WW but she isn't actually doing it. I asked her to either do the program or not. Her choice but stop paying for it if you aren't gonna use it. Probably gives her some glimmer of hope that she is registered for it even though she won't do it.

For those of you talking support. Good luck with that. No amount of support trumps the will power and drive of the person that needs to make the change. All the rest are just excuses.
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